The Toyota Tacoma is in Desperate need of a Refresh.

"Luc - The Acadian Oppo" (luc5) 11/10/2014 at 23:00 • Filed to: None

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I Actually really like the Tacoma but I can't think of another truck that is in such dire need of a refresh.

A 4.0L V6 in 2014 should be making WAY more than 236hp and a 5 speed auto? Is there any other new truck except maybe the Nissan Frontier that has a 5 speeds? Trucks now have up to 8 speeds. In 2014 6 speeds should be the bare minimum. This truck is begging for a new power plant and drivetrain. 300hp-350hp & 6spd stick/6-8spd auto

This truck is essentially a decade old while it was great 10 years ago it is definitely lacking by todays standards .The only great thing about the current Tacoma is that you can still get it with a stick shift even in higher end models.

CRider > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 11/10/2014 at 23:06

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Just squeeze in the Tundra's 5.7 V8 and supercharge it for good measure.

bob and john > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 11/10/2014 at 23:08

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I';ve noticed this. a lot of of the smaller truck just werent updated. yea, 10 years ago the truck was great but...that was 10 fucking years ago. if not update the dam thing, bring it down in price (which they didnt do that either)

Textured Soy Protein > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 11/10/2014 at 23:11

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It hasn't been updated because frankly, Toyota hasn't needed to bother with updating it. Non-full-size pickups have been a shrinking market segment in the USA for a long time. Ford sold the even-older Ranger forever, GM's small trucks were kinda terrible, and the Nissan Frontier is just about the same age.

Now that GM has the updated, and much more modern, Chevy Colorado/GMC Canyon, maybe Toyota and Nissan will get around to updating the Tacoma and Frontier.

HammerheadFistpunch > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 11/10/2014 at 23:12

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welcome to the "bitching about how old the Tacoma is" club. there are a lot of members but its a good group.

HammerheadFistpunch > CRider 11/10/2014 at 23:12

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TillTheWheelsFallOff: Brocoma > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 11/10/2014 at 23:17

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I've been really impressed with my truck, though I would admit a shortcoming is definitely in efficiency. I would love another gear. I know my engine is reliable and wouldn't trade it for more power. However, I am constantly eying a D4D swap with a stick.

HammerheadFistpunch > TillTheWheelsFallOff: Brocoma 11/10/2014 at 23:20

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got 20 grand burning a hole in your pocket?

RotRod > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 11/10/2014 at 23:20

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The Taco is on the same refresh cycle as (almost) every Nissan. That being 7 year refresh intervals. Fortunately it ages really well and somehow fits in perfect with yotas newly face-lifted truck line. I would love to see them cram the, coming at some point, Cummins motor in a future taco.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 11/10/2014 at 23:21

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Maybe drop in the version of the 4.0 from the 4Runner and a new transmission, and drop the price. That would be okay.

TillTheWheelsFallOff: Brocoma > HammerheadFistpunch 11/10/2014 at 23:21

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Just an extra kidney.

Luc - The Acadian Oppo > RotRod 11/11/2014 at 00:08

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Style wise I still love it and would drive one. but that old engine altho really reliable it is nowhere near what it needs to be in terms of power and efficency. it needs an extra 75hp or so with a bump in fuel economy on top of that. a fullsize truck should not be more powerful and efficent than the taco but it is and I see that as a problem.

Luc - The Acadian Oppo > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 11/11/2014 at 00:10

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it needs 300hp minimum in order to be remotely relevant in todays market

Luc - The Acadian Oppo > bob and john 11/11/2014 at 00:13

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You are right on the money for 30k I feel you pay so much but get so little. Make that same truck 25k and now I can see past its shortcomings.

Luc - The Acadian Oppo > Textured Soy Protein 11/11/2014 at 00:18

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If the Japanese wish to compete they will have no choice but to get with the times. I'm not a fan of GM but their small trucks are a vast improvement over the japanese offerings.

HammerheadFistpunch > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 11/11/2014 at 00:26

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yes and no. Hp sells and it doesnt matter if its way the hell up in the rev range, or if it sacrifices durability or reliablility to do it...on paper at least. So yes from a marketing perspective it does, though it certainly hasnt hurt it so far. I think no in the sense that a alrge displacement, low revving and torque filled v6 with the right transmission will achieve better real world drivability, utility and mileage than a high strung car engine tuned for truck duty.

Luc - The Acadian Oppo > HammerheadFistpunch 11/11/2014 at 00:31

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Keep logic out of this!...lol I want to roast some tires damn it!

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 11/11/2014 at 00:32

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I disagree. I think the name sell the Tacoma. People associate Toyota with durability and reliability, not quite the same as what people associate GM with. Plus the GM motor is way too high strung to be useful to work with.

HammerheadFistpunch > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 11/11/2014 at 01:00

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Well there is a supercharger from trd that puts the taco above 304 hp and 325 ftlbs for that

Denver Is Stuck In The 90s > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 11/11/2014 at 02:32

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I can't think of another truck that is in such dire need of a refresh.

Boom:

Hahayoustupidludditeshutupandgohandcrankyourmodeltalready > Denver Is Stuck In The 90s 11/11/2014 at 06:21

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Yeah, the Tacoma was redesigned for 2005. The Titan came out for the 2004 model year.

Luc - The Acadian Oppo > Denver Is Stuck In The 90s 11/11/2014 at 11:26

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Meh. The Titan was never a strong player in the truck market so it doesn't really matter. I think it was the worst selling truck in North America. So I don't think anyone would miss it.

The Tacoma on the other hand is a VERY strong seller which would make think that they would try harder to keep it up to date.

Luc - The Acadian Oppo > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 11/11/2014 at 11:33

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you are trying to make me believe that toyota is not capable of making a much stronger durable & reliable motor that has the power where it's needed? with 4L in displacement it wouldn't be hard to add 80hp and still be the workhorse it is today.

Luc - The Acadian Oppo > HammerheadFistpunch 11/11/2014 at 11:35

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If they but it on from factory and keep the price at what it is now then that would be an acceptable solution.

HammerheadFistpunch > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 11/11/2014 at 12:03

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you know, i spent a good part of last night looking into that question and I came to the conclusions that the current GNR280 2gr-fe (in the 4runner) is right where it should be in terms of hp and torque for a motor thats tuned for truck duty. I know logic isn't what you want to hear but its what I do...so here is what I found. 270 hp may not sounds all that impressive in the 300 hp world, but it has 278 ft-lbs, more than the smaller car based engines in trucks and at lower rpms.

There is always a tradeoff between rpms which give you big hp peaks and low revs which give you durability and torque (generally speaking a low revving engine is tuned for torque but they aren't corollary) I did this same exercise with the gm 4.3 ecotec II v6 vs the 3.6 high feature and came to the same conclusions .

Granted I think Toyota can do a little better, if they could get to 71 ft-lbs/liter like GM, and hit the 70 hp/liter mark they would have a great motor on their hands. 280 hp and 285 ft-lbs would be solid from 4.0 liters and that would be right in line with the best truck tuned motors in the class while still being cheap to build and durable in nature.

I think if they employed a dual vvt-i with the vvt-iw on the intake cam they could dump the smog pump, and increase their city mileage big time. Drop in a 6 speed trans and work on the aerodynamics they could easily match the canyorados mpg numbers city and highway. The big issue with the redesign isn't going to be the engine, I think toyota is going to keep it cheap and rugged, its going to be how they manage the issues of rigidity and weight gain.

Luc - The Acadian Oppo > HammerheadFistpunch 11/11/2014 at 12:15

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I wasn't even aware that the 4 runner had a different setup than the Tacoma. Why don't the just use the motor of the 4 runner. yes it's not 300hp but 270hp sounds a heck of a lot better than 236hp. and like you said with slight tuning they could bump it up to 280hp-290hp and it would be perfect. I'm surprised they haven't started using the 4 runners motor already.

Really all they need is a new transmission and the 4runner's power train and I would consider it relevant. a 20hp penalty over the GM would barely be noticeable considering that the power would be where you need it. But a 70hp difference you could definitely feel no matter which way you slice it.

This time your logic was right on the money. I LOVE how the tacoma looks so I hope they don't stray for it to far in the redesign. It seems like toyota has everything they need in the parts bin already I don't know why it's taken this long in the first place.

HammerheadFistpunch > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 11/11/2014 at 12:19

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The only difference (well the only REAL difference) between the GNR270 in the Taco and the GNR280 in the 4Runner is the addition of VVTi on both cams instead of just one...that's it. Seriously, this should have happened a long time ago. Toyota also needs a longitudinal 6-8 speed thats not oversize like the tundra unit. It's my guess that the new taco will get a GNR285 with some slight tweaks from the 4Runner engine to make something like 270+ hp and 280+ ft-lbs. Plenty in my opinion....by my opinion is coming from 212 hp and 275 ft-lbs moving 5500 lbs of Toyota so....

Luc - The Acadian Oppo > HammerheadFistpunch 11/11/2014 at 12:32

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After reading the GM comparison you linked I'm now fully onboard with the less is more of bigger displacement and lower power. After seeing the graphs the 4.3 would be "faster" and more powerful in everyday use and it's really a shame that they did not use the 4.3 That would of been an awesome truck.

Now I can't wait for a revised taco. I won't buy a 236hp taco I just can't, but if they upgrade to the 4 runners motor I'm in!

Your logic wins this round!

HammerheadFistpunch > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 11/11/2014 at 12:33

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there is a first for everything I guess!

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 11/11/2014 at 13:38

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It's not the power that is needed. It's the useable power that is available, which I think Hammerhead already sorted that out. Toyota could do that, but it would be overkill and they know it.